Thunderbolts* (2025)

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[00:00:53] That's their website. It's that easy. Promo code DTHOCT26 will get you 10% off site-wide. Stay tuned all season long to Deck The Hallmark to find some other exclusive promo codes you can only get by listening right here. But you're going to love these pastries and you need to go and buy a bunch right now. That's right, Dan. And stay tuned all holiday season long for more Kringle fun. Here's today's episode. This is a Bramble Jam podcast.

[00:01:26] And the Thunderbolts! Hi, I'm Bran and I love Marvel Mondays. Hi, I'm Ryan and I love Bran singing. And the lightning strikes. I'm Dan and I despise Marvel Mondays and this is the Deck The Hallmark Podcast. Yes! Deck The Hallmark is this podcast. Live from Italy, Ry God. Friends host this podcast.

[00:01:52] We hope you like this jolly podcast. All right, let's see. Buongiorno! Buongiorno! I thought for sure your board was going to say Italy by the time that theme song was done. You said the board was going to say Italy! They don't have markers here in Italy. They don't have markers. Wow! Boards but no markers. How about that? Well, happy groom. Congrats! Thank you, thank you. Thank you. Absolutely.

[00:02:21] Alyssa, I'm doing the pod! That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How's Italy? How's the jet lag? Good? Dude, I mean, I think I'm pretty spry right now. Like, you know, we'll see how I feel afterwards. But I just love talking Thunderbolts. More importantly than Thunderbolts, more importantly... You got it, you'll say it. More importantly... More importantly... More importantly than your wedding even. Happy October to you. Can you believe it? It's here! It's wild. It's wild. Hey, Hallmark, here's what we want.

[00:02:50] We want fall for four weeks and Christmas the rest of the year. Fall for two and a half months is what he said. Well, if I had my way, it would be Christmas all year. But then second, he wants two and a half months of fall, then two and a half months of Christmas. Yes, that's true. To end the year. Yes. You were worked up, bud. Yeah, he was. This was a great rant. Good stuff. It was a... Worked myself into a shoot. We really gave you the rub on that one. That's the rub, brother. We're talking Thunderbolts today. Thunderbolts!

[00:03:20] The final three. The final three. Can you believe it? Here we are. I really can't. When did we start doing this? It wasn't the beginning of the year. Was it January? I mean, it's 52 weeks in a year. It's got to be the beginning of the year. Yeah, I think we did it in January. It's wild. How about that? Crazy. Good for us. Good for us. Absolutely. Absolutely. I do want to ask really quickly. Sure. The plane ride over, you told me that something crazy happened. What happened? What was that about? I couldn't believe Brian Harreld was on it. Yeah. Like, it was...

[00:03:48] Sometimes he goes to Europe on vacations without his family. Yeah, yeah. It's like, I was like, oh, where's Diana? And it was just Brian. Yeah. Um, so actually, and I think, you know, I trust Brian implicitly. So I think actually he can spend a little bit of time with Alyssa right now. They can, you know, while I do the pod, uh, everything's fine. Everything is that was not... You, I mean, just the way he said it was... Is he staying in the same like hotel as you guys? I don't know. It's been a very, it's been a very, very perplexing situation.

[00:04:19] But everything's fine. He's always around? Yeah. I mean, he's like, at one point we took the boat ride. He's like the one... The gondola? You get on a gondola with the three of you? He's doing the row, row, row your boat. Yeah. Yeah. How's his Italian accent? Brian's isn't great. Brian's isn't great. He's struggling with his O's. So it's like, it's buongiorna. And I'm like, no. And he's in... But also, Brian, I don't believe Harold. I don't believe he has any Italian answers. No, but you...

[00:04:46] Like, I can do whatever I want while I'm here, right? I can go as exaggerated as I want. Yes. You've earned it. Yeah. But Alyssa's Italian, too. Yes. Oh, yeah. She's... Even though her last name's Turner, you ask her, she'd say she's 100% Italian. I mean, your wedding was quite Italian. Yes. Yes. Super Italian. Super Mario Brothers. Did you like when we... It was a Super Mario Brothers themed. Yeah. It was a Super Mario Brothers themed wedding. No one told us. Do you like when we dropped the spaghetti from the sky? I love that. Spaghetti drop. Classic. I... Boom. Boom.

[00:05:18] Goodie drop. Boom. Boom. Da-da-da-ba-da-ba-da-ba-da-ba-da-ba-da-ba-da-ba-da. Spaghetti drop. It's a me. I... Do you or Alyssa speak any Italian? Alyssa took Italian in high school. So did I. But no. The answer's no. Brian, though, has become really fluent. Once again, of all the ways to answer the question, it was a very weird way to answer. I'm not... Look, it's just weird the way you said it. I understand what you're saying. Brian's there and he's hanging out with Alyssa. The way you said it weird.

[00:05:45] I understand you and Alyssa don't speak Italian, but to start by saying Alyssa took Italian in high school, so did I. Neither of us speak it. Yeah. Brian, you got this right? Okay, cool. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. To be clear... Bon Giorno to you, too. To be clear, the way you answered that question, it sounded like Brian was knocking boots with your new wife. No! That's the way that it sounded. Alyssa listens to these, and I doubt Brian's family does, but no. No! Just letting you know, in case you missed how it sounded, that sounded.

[00:06:15] All right, we're talking Thunderbolts. We can cut this, right? We've been cutting things from episodes lately. I'm not cutting this, brother. I'm not cutting two weeks in a row. Thunderbolts! April! What did you cut last week? Nothing. You probably said the F word again, right? No. Whatever I cut last week is dead and gone. We're not going to talk about it. Oh, man. Let's talk Thunderbolts. As good as you've ever been, Brian. Let's talk Thunderbolts. It originally premiered at the Cineworld Leicester Square. No, it didn't. I tell you what.

[00:06:45] You're making things up. April 22nd, 2025, and then everywhere else, May 2nd, 2025, and it went a little something like this. Things kick off with Yelena blowing up a laboratory for CIA Director Valentina Allegra de Fontaine. You've got to remember the duh. Duh. That's right. Secretary of Defense. So funny. Why, you ask?

[00:07:10] Well, Valentina is trying to erase any evidence connecting her with the OXE group and its mysterious Project Century. Okay? With Valentina facing impeachment, she decides that the best course of action here is to clean up her mess and then also clean up the mess that was cleaning up the mess. And by that, I mean sending all of her former operatives to a place where they will then kill each other.

[00:07:38] So that's not good, right? So they all head to the secret OXE facility with an instruction to kill the other people. Naturally, things don't go according to plan. Ava. Ava.

[00:08:12] Ava. And then she quickly realizes that they weren't sent to complete a mission. They were sent to be killed alongside all of the evidence for Valentina's crime. So they decide to work together. And after coming into contact with Bob, Yelena begins to experience these visions of some of her worst memories. But I'm sure it's nothing. That's not like a weird Bob thing, huh?

[00:08:37] Valentina learns that the group survived and discovers that Bob was actually a presumed dead volunteer from the Century experiments. When she arrives at the facility, Bob decides that he's going to sacrifice himself so that the other three can get away. He's getting shot like crazy. He's good to go. Apparently, Bob is bulletproof. Apparently, Bob can fly. Apparently, Bob has no idea what the heck is going on.

[00:09:06] Bob eventually is captured and taken to Manhattan, where Valentina plans to introduce Bob to the public as her new super-powered hero, hoping that that PR stunt will save her from the impeachment trial. Yelena's father figure, Alexi, overheard Valentina's plan while he was working as a chauffeur, as he does. And he shows up to rescue Yelena.

[00:09:33] John Walker sarcastically gives the group a name, the Thunderbolts, inspired by Yelena's childhood soccer team. So we'll just say Thunderbolts, Asterix, until we get a different name. Asterix? I love it. Asterix. Asterix. Asterix. Things get even messier when Bucky Barnes, who's a congressman now, learns about what happened. With the help of Valentina's assistant, Mel, who suspects that Valentina might actually be the bad guy in this situation,

[00:10:02] Bucky captures the Thunderbolts and plans to have him testify during Valentina's impeachment proceedings. But after hearing what happened to Bob, the group decides that the new priority is getting Bob and finding him and making sure that everything's okay and saving him, basically. They discover that Valentina has convinced Bob to become a superhero named Sentry. Unfortunately, Sentry is basically unstoppable.

[00:10:27] He easily takes down the Thunderbolts and refuses to kill them when Valentina orders him to do that, believing that they're not actually a threat. And Bob begins to lose control. His power is growing. He turns against Valentina. Mel has to use the failsafe kill switch to take him down before he kills her. But instead of solving the problem, it unleashes something much worse. You guys know what I'm talking about? The Void! Ba-boom!

[00:10:56] The Void is like Bob's destructive alter ego black shadow thing. It's serious stuff. It's born from his depression and insecurities and childhood trauma and the Sentry procedure that he went through. And now it's taken over New York City. New York City is turning into darkness. It's trapping people through shadows and whatnot and putting them in their worst memories. It's not good stuff, I'll say. The Thunderbolt realizes...

[00:11:26] Thunderbolts, I'm sorry. It's the singular bolt there. The Thunderbolts... The general Thunderbolts? That's the president. I'm sorry. The Thunderbolts... Who's playing that guy? The Thunderbolts realize that the only way to stop the Void is to reach Bob from inside of the Void. So Yelena enters the darkness. It's forced to confront her own traumatic past, eventually finding Bob hiding inside of his childhood bedroom. The rest of the Thunderbolts end up... Thunderbirds? Thunderbirds. Yeah.

[00:11:55] The rest of the Thunderbolts join her. Are the Thundercats there, too? Yeah, stage. All of the Thunders. And the Oklahoma City Thunder. They're all there. And together, they make their way through Bob's memories. They find the Void that is inside of the lab from the beginning of this movie, actually. And he just wrecks everybody. The dude's serious. But Bob tries to fight back. He can't.

[00:12:22] And that is when the Thunderbolts do the only thing that they can think to do, which is remind Bob that he's not alone. They hug him. They tell him that they believe in him. And that is the power of friendship, folks. Amen. And they are able to take control of the Void. The darkness disappears. New York City is saved once again. And everybody gets back to normal. With the Void now defeated, the Thunderbolts are ready to take Valentina down.

[00:12:47] But before they can do that, she brings them up on stage and announces that the Thunderbolts are actually the new Avengers. They're an asterisk. I know. Taking credit for everything that they've accomplished. They go up on stage. And Yelena whispers to her, we own you now. And honestly, I don't think she's wrong. And that, my friends, was the Thunderbolts. Asterisk. The new Avengers. New Avengers. Let's take a break. Let's come back.

[00:13:17] We'll break this movie down. I'm going to go four segments today. Okay. I'm letting everybody know up front. I'm letting everybody know up front. It's a four-segment day here on Deck the Hallmark. Dan, the way that the light there looks on YouTube, it looks like there's a little jump rope on the floor. It does. See that? Anyway, welcome back, everybody. We're talking Thunderbolts. This is our third to last. That's right.

[00:13:46] This Fantastic Four and the brand new day. That's all we got. Brave New World. Brand new day. Brand new day. Why the heck not? All right. Let's get to this one. Let's start with a hot tag. It's where we share exactly how you felt about this movie. Do you not hold back? And I'll start with you. Right guy. Right guy. Thunderbolts. Thunder yay? Or thunder nay. Or thunder nay. Yeah. I saw this in theaters twice. I haven't seen it since. So this was my third watch. I'll be honest. I don't have. This is by far the least amount of notes I've had on any of these films. Hard to wait what this movie.

[00:14:16] I will say that right now. I don't think there's much to do here. So it's interesting, Dan, because I was thinking about things you've said a lot during this watch. Because you've just been random moments throughout since the beginning of the year, apparently. I felt like you've said things that makes me think. And I don't. I want to wait until you go. That makes me think you're down on this film. I even with those two viewings in theaters, I didn't have like a strong feeling on this one way or another.

[00:14:41] And what I will say is that I actually, up until the third act of this movie. Hold your horses, Dan. Yeah. I had this movie 11th. I had literally put it in letterbox at 11th overall. Third act's tough. The third act of this movie tries to be completely different than any other third act in the MCU, which is really novel. And I give them a lot of credit because we, us and the greater world, has said all these third acts of these MCU movies are the same.

[00:15:11] Some of them are a lot better than others, but they all operate the same exact way. This does something completely. There's no big fight sequence for New York. We're talking about, to Brian's synopsis, the power of friendship and having these deep emotional moments that are decently built up throughout the film. The third act just doesn't work, though. I give them tons and tons of credit for the swing.

[00:15:37] But for me, and I'll be curious how you two feel, which isn't to say that I want the rinse-wash-repeat of what the MCU always does. So I feel like I'm being a little hypocritical. No, but there's a reason they've made hundreds of superhero movies, right, Guy? We do want to see similar as long as it's done well and it's different enough and it's compelling. So I don't think you're being hypocritical. I think there's a reason these movies are the most popular movies in the world. There is some similarity that's expected.

[00:16:06] It's like Hallmark movies on a bigger scale. Totally. So with that said, to backtrack now to Tarantino it, the movie works for me when it's a borderline bottle episode, which, like, the first hour is. And I could see people being like, well, they're just literally in – the heroes are just in one location for the vast majority of the first hour of the film. I actually love that stuff. I thought that all of them, when they're in the lady from The New Adventures of Old Christine's Bunker, like, I thought all that stuff really worked.

[00:16:35] The team dynamic here is great. And even though we – I think we're all a little down on Red Guardian and Black Widow, he definitely doesn't fit the vibe of that film. He really fits the vibe of this film. It's a nice addition. When him and Bucky get inserted into the chemistry that was already developed, all of that stuff works. The other thing that doesn't work for me here, though, is that I like the character of Bob, but I think the character of the century could be interesting. All that stuff is just wickedly rushed.

[00:17:01] We go from literally a bottle episode for the first hour to within 20 minutes. This guy is, like, as strong as any villain we've almost ever had, shy of Thanos and a few others. And then he turns on the Thunderbolts. Then he turns on the lady from The New Adventures of Old Christine. Whiplash. And so it's too much. Without the final third of the film, like I said, the third act, I would have had this at 11th. This still finishes at a very respectable 17th, which I think is, like, basically middle of the pack. That's top half.

[00:17:31] Yeah. So I really, really, really liked the majority of this, but the end trails off for me, Brandon. I give them credit for it, but it didn't work for me. Yeah, I do really like this movie. I like it as a movie more than I like it as a Marvel movie. I think the character development is great. I think Florence Pugh's crushing it in this movie. She's phenomenal. She's unreal in this movie. And, yeah, I agree with a lot of what you said, Ryga.

[00:18:00] It is, like, a really fun movie when they're all together and they're trying to get out and they're doing the stuff. Like, it's really, really great. And I really appreciate what they're trying to do at the end here with the – like, that we just – we need each other. Like, it is a good message, albeit a bit heavy-handed. But if I got the message, that means it's a little heavy-handed and I got the message in this movie. Usually I watch a movie and I'm like, that was fun.

[00:18:29] And I didn't understand anything deeper that they're trying to say there. This movie, it's hard to not know what they're going for. It's a Marvel movie. They're going to hammer you pretty good. And so I really do like this movie in the grand scheme of things when it comes to the Marvel movies and the whatnots. I'm a little bit lower on it in that regard. But I think this is a really, really solid movie. I got this movie at 24. Yeah, I don't like this movie, but I desperately want to like this movie a lot.

[00:19:00] I love the – first of all, Florence Pugh is amazing. She's amazing in this movie. And I also love – Pugh! Pugh! Pugh! Pugh! That's good. Pugh! That's good Pugh. That's good. Yeah. I think that it is a – That's good floor. It's a very good – it's a very bold swing to make a superhero movie about mental health and how we break trauma and we heal from trauma but we still carry it with us. Kudos all around for making this movie. Totally.

[00:19:28] As a property that's supposed to revive Marvel, this fails almost across the board. As an introspective movie about mental health with a stunning lead that gives a star turn in Florence Pugh, it succeeds. But the problem is they want the former, not the latter. They don't want that first version. They want to kind of Trojan horse that first version in to the second version which is the

[00:19:52] this is a big bad Marvel movie that is supposed to revive the Marvel Cinematic Universe before Doomsday and Spider-Man get here. And it is not that at all. If you want to make a movie without really a central bad guy, the bad guy was in us all. When there was one set of footprints, it was our depression carrying us. That's basically the idea of this movie. If you want to make that movie, all of the characters have to be incredibly compelling in their journey. They are not. Florence Pugh is.

[00:20:22] The rest of these characters, to varying degrees of success, are somewhat to not at all compelling. I do. The other big problem for me is I've never liked David Harbour in these movies. Never. I didn't like him in Black Widow. I don't like him here. I think David Harbour is incredibly capable at some very specific roles in acting. I think obviously in Stranger Things he's great. He has amazing comedic timing. I don't like him in these movies. I just don't like him.

[00:20:51] And so that stings because the bottle episode at the beginning, to your point, I think works pretty well as these folks are discovering that they're all about to get killed by Selina Meyer. Not Selina Meyer. That's Veep. I was talking in the chat. You said old Christine. And somebody was like, how dare he say old Christine? It's clear. I'm joking. I know who Julia Louis-Dreyfus is. That person said she'll always be Elaine. And I was like, I would accept Selina Meyer from Veep, her best performance in my opinion. She's amazing in this movie.

[00:21:20] Wendell Pierce also as the senator, I believe, amazing in this movie. The bottle episode stuff early on is really compelling. After that, this movie doesn't have the bandwidth to pull off the plot it's trying to pull or the runtime. It doesn't have the weight to pull off the depression, mental health stuff. And it doesn't have the pizzazz or charisma to pull off reviving the MCU. It fills none of those buckets. And so the problem is, is that you do reward the swing.

[00:21:49] I have it at 24 as well because the swing of the movie is a big one. And the lead performance, barely a lead, but the lead performance is also excellent. But the movie doesn't work because it tries to do too much. It succeeds at none of it. And it leaves us basically where we started with at least an interesting swing. You know, I like the first 30 or 40 minutes of Brave New World maybe better than this movie.

[00:22:16] But the problem is, is the next hour and a half of Brave New World is so bad, so actively bad that you appreciate the swing of this movie. And I do believe there's a world. It's not for me. I do believe there's a world where you would just have fun with these characters and you go along with the last 30 or 40 minutes where people are just turning into ink blots. That all lost me. You, they lost, they missed me completely with how depression manifests itself in Bob's psyche and how it just means ink blotting people.

[00:22:44] I just, that didn't, that didn't, I got what they were doing. I got the, they, the, the, the hammer they used to nail this metaphor in was bigger than the screen, right? Like it's just massive, right? But I, I just didn't care about all, all of, maybe there's some people out there that aren't suffering from depression. They're getting ink blotted. Like it just was, I don't know. None of that really worked for me, but I appreciate the swing. Uh, let's get to our feels. Uh, right guy.

[00:23:11] I mean, you can pick any Florence moment, uh, that you want, but she really crushes the breakdown scene to her dad, uh, right before everyone starts getting amazing ink blotted Thanos. Um, but that's the other thing, by the way, it's like, we literally just made people disappear. Yeah. It's like, I think there could have been a better visual. I don't know if we can have people just disappear anymore. I'm like, it's diminishing returns, but she's incredible. And like, you know, up until like she gets some, I have black widow higher than both of you.

[00:23:41] I think I still have it in my top 12. Um, but like she gets some obviously heavy material there. I got it 14. I got it. I like that movie. Like I said, that movie, if it just stuck the landing a little better, I think it would probably be in my top 10. Um, but, um, you know, in, in Hawkeye, she's mostly comedic relief and the, but like, and she's great with the comedy stuff. Like I, around the house, especially at Christmas time, I'll just go, okay. It'd be job. She's just so funny. Like, and she's like, but, um, she's wonderful here.

[00:24:10] And like, she, I let's literally give her a suit so she can be the head of the Avengers. Like, like, you know, it's like I, she could be the captain America, like talent wise in real life terms. Like I think the only thing that holds her back from being the face of Marvel is that it probably doesn't make sense for someone without superpowers to again, charging Dr. Doom, as I said last week, but she's amazing. And that scene in particular, she's wonderful.

[00:24:35] Um, yeah, I think there's a lot of cool, uh, visual stuff in this movie specifically early on. I think it's, yes, the first, the opening scene there where she's like, uh, going into this, uh, lab. They do this really cool, uh, overhead tracking shots inside this hallway where she's taking people down and it was awesome. It was a very cool, really well done. Great stunt work by whoever stunt person is. And, uh, really liked that stuff.

[00:25:03] So the fact that there's, they're still able to do things every once in a while in these movies where you're like, oh wow, that was actually really cool and really well done. Uh, I appreciate it. Dano? Yeah. Any scene where Julie Louis-Dreyfus's character is having to speak outward facing in public is 10 of 10 in this movie. Whether she's on trial or like, or, or whatever she's testifying under oath or whether she's doing a press conference, it's peak.

[00:25:31] Like she is one of the best comedic actors ever. Like point blank, like go watch Veep or even new adventures of old Christine or Seinfeld. Like she's on, she's unreal. She's unmatched in her talent, her ability to yes. And, and to carry a scene anytime she's speaking frontward facing and not being, she's funny as, and fun is, as a sinister villain, but she's hilarious when she has to speak in front of others. I love it. I love that.

[00:26:00] Give me more Julie Louis-Dreyfus. In fact, give me more Julie Louis-Dreyfus in this movie in, in, in the MCU and give me less Sebastian Stan. I know that he's there for a reason. I get that people love Sebastian Stan and I think he's a good actor. I just couldn't be more over Bucky. I don't, don't. Oh, I like funny Bucky. Oh my God. Like I just, why are we still talking about Bucky? Has he been in 10 of these movies? It's quite a bit. I also, by the way, Brandon. Is Bucky in the most Marvel movies? Oh my God.

[00:26:29] It might be. He's in so many. Something to think about. Because he's in Ant-Man 2, the credits. He's in all three, four Captain, no, three Captain America. Is he in Brave New World? He's not in Brave New World. He's not in Brave New World. That'd be silly. Yeah. Why would we do that? He's in Thunderbolts. Then he's in how many Avengers movies? At all? Just Infinity War and Endgame? He's not in Ultron. He's not in Ultron. So that's seven that we know of.

[00:26:56] I just don't need any more of that. But it's fine. All right. Let's take a break. We'll come back and we'll do the Wait What and the What a Marvel here on Deck the Hallmark. Sit down. Sit down. We got work to do, everybody. He's in nine. He's in nine MCU films. RDJ has to be in more, obviously.

[00:27:25] So I just and then here's the thing is is two of those nine are post or mid credit scenes. He's just kind of always around. I just if you guys need me, I'm here just for a quick drop in. I'm ready to go. Isn't him and Scar Joe going to be in the new Batman whenever that comes out? What? I heard Sebastian Stan was going to be Harvey Dent. And Scar Joe? Yeah, Scar Joe's playing Poison Ivy. Scar Joe.

[00:27:50] But I did not know that as Harvey Dent's a great, great casting. Who's the Batman? Pattinson. Oh, but I'm sorry. I thought that this. I mean, that's a fair question. That movie came out 15 years ago. But aren't they already doing another one? No, I don't. I don't know what. I don't know. For some reason, I thought they announced they were doing another one. And it was just going to. I don't know if the James Gunn stuff will relate or they're right. Just I don't know. I don't. I don't. I really like Pattinson. I like that movie.

[00:28:18] Chris Nolan did Dark Knight's Inception, Dark Knight Rises, and Interstellar in the time it's taken to make The Batman Part 2. He made four absolutely stunners. Like just four movies. And if you want to take Dark Knight Rises out, he made three movies that people hold up in the pantheon of popcorn movies. And they've not made a sequel to the Pattinson Batman. Well, that might be because Pattinson is in all of them. You know, he's like, oh, he only does Nolan movies. Oh, that's true. But it was a script.

[00:28:46] The reason the Batman 2 is happening is they kept rewriting the script over and over again. I'm really excited for primetime, too. Primetime was great. Or I've already seen it by this point. And it was great. I'm seeing it with subtitles. American subtitles. Yeah, you are. All right. Let's get to the way what. So we're talking about what in this movie made us go away. What? I'll start with you, Brageye. Yeah. To Dan's point, I don't have a lot. I have two.

[00:29:09] It's funny that the MCU treats the Avengers not being a thing as a one-for-one for there no longer being superheroes that can protect the country and world at large. It's like people are popping up every week with powers. Like, okay, we don't have the Avengers, but like, so. Every movie we watch that doesn't. Every movie we watch that isn't a Captain Marvel movie. The wait, what is all caps? Captain Marvel still exists, right? Like that really, like legitimately.

[00:29:39] She doesn't care about Earth. She's not going to care about Earth during Doomsday. I don't know. She's too busy singing and dancing with her friends. Tim Blake Nelson told me in the last movie that apparently there's more worlds than just Earth. That's true. They didn't even reference that in this movie. That's a white one. Yeah. It's rough. Last one here. I want to be sensitive with how I say this. I don't think there's anything wrong with saying this.

[00:30:05] I'm not sure if the science totally checks out on Bob getting to be a thousand times stronger or more than Captain America because he's mentally unwell. I'm not trying to be funny. It's like, you know what I mean? Like, that's what the movie says, you know, that since he's got, you know, mental. His demons are causing him to be stronger than they anticipate.

[00:30:35] I'm not trying to be funny. I just don't know if we're taking all of this stuff at face value and all of this is ridiculous, obviously. Harrison Ford was a big red guy last week. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I'm dying, gosh darn it. But I think your point, though, right, guy, is that, you know, one of the biggest tropes in hero stories are the villain is on paper stronger because they have allowed their demons and their, you know, mental health, their trauma, whatever, to take over. In almost all those cases, Anakin Skywalker being a great example.

[00:31:04] And the reason that the villain loses is not because they're not stronger. It's because of their hubris or because they're undone by something they don't have that's intangible, like love or self-sacrifice or mercy or grace or whatever. That's a pretty common trope. So I see why he would be stronger. But a hundred times, what he can do here doesn't seem to math. I agree with you there. It doesn't seem to math. It's not fair. He's like a top five strong Marvel villain. Yeah.

[00:31:30] Like, and so, whereas in the asterisk in that movie. Yeah. We joke about it, but like Captain America can like jump really high, like, you know, and like if the only difference there is just their, their brain composition, that just, I don't know if that works plot wise, but I do understand the spirit of what you're saying, Dan. And I like that. I just think it could have been illustrated. One hundred percent. But I do think they're going to need him to, to mess around with doom. I think he's going to become, and that's Lewis Pullman. That's Bill Pullman's son. Shout out Bill.

[00:32:00] Shout out Bill Pullman. Today we celebrate our independence day. Who's going to be, both of them are going to be in a space balls too. So that's exciting. Lewis is? Lewis is going to be in there with his dad. I really like Lewis. Yeah. I think he's Lone Star's son. He's really fun in this movie. And what's his name is, is the Captain America in this movie. What is his name? John Walker. But, but what's the, the actor? The actor is also the son of a, of a, of an actor. The son of an actor. Yeah.

[00:32:30] What's, oh, it's, his name is Wyatt Russell. Why did I think he was the son of an actor? He might be. Am I making this up? Anyway, it doesn't matter, folks. By the way, he's really, really funny here. And, but again, it's like, you have no idea who he is. That's Kurt Russell and Goldie Hawn's son. Kurt, yeah. Yeah. That's Kate Hudson's brother. Glad I wasn't going crazy. Yeah. It's Kate Hudson's brother there. Wyatt Russell. You would, you would appreciate him even more. He has a, again, a really good arc in the, the Captain America.

[00:32:58] I really like him in this movie. He's great. Like really compelling character. And his arc really pays off here if you've seen the show. So it's a bummer that no one probably saw the show. We should get to it. We should do it. To your, to your point though. Like the, is one of, one of them dies early on. So we don't need to worry about her. Ava. Is it the other girl? Right. The, the other one that's a part of the group. Bob. Yeah. Yeah. The girl from Ant-Man and the Wasp. Yeah. It's just like, not like I forgot. She was in there.

[00:33:26] If there was a, if the third member here was more compelling, I'd be all in on new Avengers. Between, uh, uh, Yelena, Nuke, the, the Captain America guy. And I, I do like, I like Bob and I do like Harbor. Yeah. Um, I think Harbor's gotten better with every time he's done it. Oh man. I just, I, I just couldn't be more over that. That's fair. And I like, I understand. I like funny Bucky, like I said. So yeah, it all, it all works for me on that level.

[00:33:56] So, um, I am going to just say, don't kill people. Okay. Don't kill people. But if you are going to do that and your plan is to burn them all alive, just do it. Don't give them a two minute timer. Dude, that's mine. Now just do it. The two, you, there's no points to the two minute timer.

[00:34:25] We have teleprompters that we have teleprompters that can be shields. We can clearly just burn people alive without two minutes. Light them on fire. A very convenient two minute incinerator warning. What? Why'd they need that? Was that? I read. So this was my only way. Oh, okay. I'm sorry. No, no, no, no. We didn't talk about it before. And this is proof that we don't do that. But there was a, there, I've read about this. Okay. And the defense of this. I've read about this.

[00:34:55] I was like, why would you do that? Dan's looked into these before. I literally was like, what's the purpose of a two? Like I looked it up cause I was like, I'm, I'm, I want to know more about this because there's always a defense. Marvel people have a defense for every weight. What? That we come up with everyone. People that are dying the wool. Marvel people. They have a defense. The defense of this is, is that that wasn't for them. That was for folks that would work in the facility. If that thing was triggered so that they could get out.

[00:35:23] And I would submit to you, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. There are people working in a facility that could all burn at any minute and they're going to get a two minutes warning. Maybe we make that eight hours. Maybe we make it. Yes. Maybe we make it hours. Exactly. We're concerned for your safety. You do have more than 120 seconds to leave the building. You dummies. That's crazy. That makes it worse. That's crazy. No, it's for the workers. It's for the workers. What are you talking about?

[00:35:54] Honestly, to be fair though, the version where they have hours is probably the best version of this movie. Yeah. That's true. We all have to stay there. If they were just in that box the whole time, this is probably a top five Marvel movie. Yeah. I don't disagree. They are all so good at immediately spotting the body in the night sky. Like when Bob goes up, they're all like, there he is. There he is. Yeah. Guys, it's hard. It's hard to find things. I don't know if you know this. The higher he gets, the tinier he gets in our eyes. They're just like, there he is.

[00:36:23] We got him. We got him right there. I see him. I think you kind of pointed this out in your hot take, but he does get incredibly comfortable with his powers real quick. Like he's able to go, yeah, I got it. Oh, yeah. I got it. I'm good to go. Boom. Boom. Boom. Easy peasy. Willy nilly. And that's it, Dano. Yeah. So I can make one of my What a Marvels. Oh, wait, what? I just got confirmed to the committee. What are you going to do for What a Marvel? I've got two. I had two. So we're good to go. So Bucky was elected to Congress.

[00:36:54] That election, I mean, this guy was a mass terrorist. I just, you know, in current modern day elections, you can dig up info or data on anyone. You can find them saying something that could cost them an election. This guy. Sometimes you're recorded on tape inside the bus. Sometimes there are multiple cameras in the woods recording you killing Tony Stark's parents.

[00:37:17] Sometimes you murdered the parents of the guy that saved the universe. Sometimes you did that. And then America was like, he's got my vote. Is he? I wasn't myself. He feels pretty true to life. Yeah, feels pretty true to life. But who was he running against? The devil incarnate? Like, who was the guy that- Bucky, I challenged you to a Senate race. That's right.

[00:37:44] Yeah, like, who was on the other side of the aisle going, hey, he killed- Like, what- Was he unopposed? How did he win an election? He won an election. He didn't get appointed. He- They make it a point to tell us, Bucky, the Winter Soldier, won a national- Or no, a congressional election in the United States of America. Mass murderer. Mass murderer on-

[00:38:12] Like, caught, reported, mass murderer Bucky. He wasn't himself. The Winter Soldier. It got away from me. He almost killed Nick Fury. Guys, he's committed so many crimes. This is crazy. I like it. Sorry, Brent, when you said that, it made me think of when that guy emailed about too much T-shirt talk, and you're like, yeah, I got away from us. He got away from us. The two things Brent likes to say is he got away from us, and we're having fun. We're having fun.

[00:38:43] All right, what a marvel. What a marvel. Ryan Guy, what are you marveling at? I don't know if you guys know this. The Russos directed the second post-credit scene, the one that finished it. Brent, I don't even know if you watched it. This is good. This is my other one. So people are just- I can't wait for losing here. It's- Yeah, we should really do pre-production, huh? Nah, nah. That's stupid. I think their style is because even on first watch in the theater, I knew it was them, right? It's just like, I just knew it was them.

[00:39:13] It felt- And again, I'm not saying it's for everyone, and people still have concerns about Doomsday, and they can say, well, they just kind of do the same thing over and over, but give me that same thing over and over. There's that 90 seconds. I was like, oh yeah, we're going to be fine. No, I think 90 seconds is really low-balling. That's the longest post-credit scene in- It is like two and a half minutes. It's a long- They do a whole- They have a whole conversation. They don't have use of the name. Copyright's gone.

[00:39:39] It's so long before we get to the big Fantastic Four reveal. Right. Like very long. It wasn't like- You would agree then. I know that you're not as high on the Russes as I am. That like, it is like so distinctly- It's just a dialogue scene. That's right. Like it's so distinctly them I can tell immediately. Which isn't to say that this film is made poorly. I'm not like contrasting it in that sense, but it gets me excited for Doomsday. I am just- I'm looking forward to them trying this. Mine was how long the scene is, but I just looked it up.

[00:40:10] The longest post-credit scene in MCU theatrical film history is Thunderbolts. Oh, wow. Okay. At two minutes, 54 seconds. Oh, even longer. That's like real run time. They revealed that Chala had a son quicker. Like that's a crazy, like that's a crazy thing. Although that's a mid-credits. Maybe that's not included in here. But oh my, like the scene was forever. But I didn't mind it. It just was like, oh, why wasn't this a part of the movie?

[00:40:39] Why did I have to wait for all the credits for this? Sure. So my, they, the press conference at the end happens on the streets, right? When the heck did they set this sucker up? I know they were originally, they were going to announce. So the four seasons landscaping. Yeah. They were going to obviously announce Bob as new superhero, but I have to imagine that that originally was not going to happen on the streets, right?

[00:41:05] This was a quick pivot based off of what happened just a second ago. Yeah. And they're like, get it out. What a turn. Get the stage out here. Set up the curtains. Yeah. We're doing a press conference. We know you were just living in your deepest depression. But if you can get here quickly. You got to get down here with your cameras immediately. And what's crazy here is that's the thing. They're cutting through the, uh, the breaking news of the, of people were back folks.

[00:41:34] People were gone and now they're back. Oh, a breaking news. We have the new Avengers. That's right. We've got them on the streets. And one of them was responsible for why you were gone into your deepest, darkest fears. That's right. He's good now though. Yeah, he's good. Um, he's good for it. He's good for it. We're having fun. It's not going to happen again. But yeah, I just, they set that up real quick. How'd they do that is what, is what I wanted to know. Dano? Uh, no, I talked through mine. Okay, great. We did it everybody. Congratulations to us next week. Fantastic Four. Oof. Here we go. Oof.

[00:42:04] That's not a good sound. I've only seen it the once. Maybe I'll love it. I only saw it once too. So. So come on back for that. Until then, maybe the first to wish you a Merry Christmas. Deck The Hallmark is a Bramble Jam podcast produced by Brandon Gray. And you have that Greenville, South Carolina. For more information on the show, you can go to deckdahlmark.com. Come follow us on the socials at Deck the Hallmark. And leave us a five-star rating review on Apple Podcasts. Help others find the show. Help the show out financially and become a double-decker. Get the best corner of the internet. Ad-free podcasting. Live video watch-alongs. Movie chats. So much more.

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